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DarkXL Update 7 - Replanning and Upcoming Alpha Release.
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Patrick Haslow
Trandoshan

Joined: 25 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 14, 2008 22:22    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Gez wrote:
Patrick Haslow wrote:
Which reminds me- are you going to alter the rendering of WAXes so that they are always displayed perpendicular to the point of view, or would that look bizarre?



If you're looking at 2D sprites from an extreme top or down angle, it'll look bizarre no matter how they're rendered. See for example this picture -- it's from MAP01 of Doom II but would apply just the same in DarkXL.

There's no perfect rendering solution, a sprite isn't going to look like a model. Depending on the sprite, it may look better rendered as X-axis billboard (for tall and thin things) or as XY-axis billboard (for fat and round things); but it's still better to avoid looking at them from extreme angles.



Yeah I mentioned that earlier...Dark Forces wasn't meant to be viewed from a steep z angle, so there really isn't a perfect solution.

Taton
Trandoshan

Joined: 25 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 14, 2008 23:38    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Couldn't the z of the mouselook be limited? Maybe You could make a flag for sectors that you can only look so far up in that sector.

Just some ideas.

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"A fight should be clean and elegant, without waste"
-Asuka Langley Sohryu, Evangelion

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 15, 2008 02:35    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
It may work but I think it would make gameplay a little funky.

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I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

sheepandshepherd
Trandoshan

Joined: 01 Apr 2008
PostPosted: Aug 15, 2008 02:53    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Yeah . . . I think I'd rather see a few adjoin problems than have more limitations placed on my view. That really bugged me in DF. I guess it would help if you have a particularly bad sector, but the modder really needs to be careful not to overuse the flag if lucius includes it.

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Aug 15, 2008 03:39    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
I planned on having an optional limiter on how much you can look up and down to match Dark Forces. It would default to off (the current behavior) but could be enabled for people wanting a more authentic experience. However I suspect most people wouldn't enable it - plenty of people like mouse look in Doom source ports even with the sprite issues, the freedom it offers outweights the occasional rendering issue for most people I think.

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 15, 2008 07:00    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
I do notice it while playing the new doom ports, but I find it more amusing than an annoyance.

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I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

klasodeth
Trandoshan

Joined: 03 Mar 2008
PostPosted: Aug 15, 2008 07:30    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Yeah, as long as Kyle doesn't take paper-cut damage from hitting a sprite edge-on, I'm not particularly concerned.

Marley
Gamorrean

Joined: 30 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 12:01    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Can we have an update? The excitement is killing me!

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*ZaP*

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 18:06    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Not too much to say in an update, I've been trying to get everything wrapped up for the build. I'm trying to push for a release later today. There may be a few issues that get left to be resolved in the following build - I'll mention those when I do the release.

_________________
DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Gez
Gamorrean

Joined: 05 May 2008
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 18:32    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
lucius wrote:
I'm trying to push for a release later today.


See? That's the kind of things to say for an update. Very Happy

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 19:43    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
I didn't want to say it'd be out, then not release it. Hopefully I'll make it though - if you guys don't mind a few bugs that still need to be fixed.Smile

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 19:59    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
I'd rather wait, but it's up to you. I'm looking forward to nothing but a boring six working days this week otherwise. Having it in the middle would shave off some of the exhaustion.

But as I am having a rather bitter day so far, a release later would help some too, but the prior would be acceptable.

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 20:37    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
The next release after this one should come much quicker. Anyway, if I get my list finished then I'll make the release. It looks promising so far.Smile

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 21:47    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
My week is already looking up, I just bought a new computer as of 10 minutes ago Very Happy

I will be the proud owner of a new iMac in about 3 or 4 days.

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I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 21:58    Post subject: Release Emminent View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Good news!

I just finished my list of tasks for the Alpha release. I will make the release today and make a announcement/thread!

Thanks for waiting everyone.
Very Happy

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

sheepandshepherd
Trandoshan

Joined: 01 Apr 2008
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 21:59    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
YESSSS!!! Very Happy

Marley
Gamorrean

Joined: 30 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 17, 2008 22:03    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Can't wait til I get home from work tonight. Awesomeness...

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*ZaP*

Taton
Trandoshan

Joined: 25 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Aug 18, 2008 03:15    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
*Jumps for Joy*

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"A fight should be clean and elegant, without waste"
-Asuka Langley Sohryu, Evangelion

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Aug 18, 2008 03:48    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
In case anybody missed it, the alpha build is released. You can find it here: http://df-21.net/phpbb/viewtopic.php_t=1339

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Feb 04, 2009 09:33    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Just thought I'd mention that Dark XL works beautifully under my Asus Netbook I just bought.

Specs (Nothing Spectacular)

Intel Atom 1.6ghz
1gb RAM
1024x600 display
Intel GMA 950 graphics chip

Not much different from my old mac mini, just a tad slower but fast enough to run DXL perfectly.

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

Marley
Gamorrean

Joined: 30 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Feb 12, 2009 13:13    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
*Bump*

Any updates lucius? Very Happy

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*ZaP*

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Feb 12, 2009 18:26    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
I'm still alive and there will updates soon, but not yet.

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 19:00    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Burning Gundam wrote:
Just thought I'd mention that Dark XL works beautifully under my Asus Netbook I just bought.

Specs (Nothing Spectacular)

Intel Atom 1.6ghz
1gb RAM
1024x600 display
Intel GMA 950 graphics chip

Not much different from my old mac mini, just a tad slower but fast enough to run DXL perfectly.



Actually, I will make an update that Talay in a couple of areas gets extremely slow and choppy. This may not be a problem with DXL because it seems to do this on other FPS's too. Oddly enough, secbase and sewers gave me little to no problems with framerate.

Oh... and I upgraded from 1gb of RAM to 2gb.

UPDATE: I think I discovered the problem, I found it while fiddling around in wireframe mode.

Okay, this is at the beginning where you first land looking towards the path immediately behind you and to the right. From this angle it looks fine. No framerate drops or anything.



until..... I move right just a teeny bit...


OMG!!! Framerate goes down the toilet. I have no idea if this is a bug or if this was done on purpose. it only happens when the player is outside and looking in the direction where all that is going on.

Any reason for this? Dark XL would run great on this tiny computer if it didn't render everything like that.

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I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

Last edited by Burning Gundam on Feb 14, 2009 19:57; edited 1 time in total

The MAZZTer
Death Star
Death Star

Joined: 25 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 19:56    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
If you are OUTSIDE the game world then most engines will render everything... clipping only works when you're inside the game world.

If you're actually inside the game world then yes this is a problem...

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Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 20:05    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
In both screenshots I am outside. it's only when I moved slightly right that everything got rendered.

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I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 20:10    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
This happened because the build you have has an issue with portal culling in some cases - the culling with the new build, with the improved portal system I talked about before, does exact portal culling and clipping which fixes this problem. So yes its a problem in the current build but one that is already fixed in the next build.

Remember where this happens so you can tell me how it runs in the same area when the next build comes out. Smile

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 20:33    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Here is what the same area looks like now, there aren't any points where all that geometry becomes visible now.


Note I adjusted the "curves" to make the lines easier to see.

As you can see, it's much better now. You'll notice that the floor may look weird for the sector the player is standing in. This is because the floor/ceiling polygons are no longer tessellated. Due to the fact that almost every sector is clipped, its actually faster to treat the floor and ceilings as quads then a bunch of triangles. All my screenshots lately have used this system, it actually works quite well. Smile And the nice thing is that sector complexity no longer has a large impact other then just having to deal with more quads (walls). So in the end, sector geometry is treated only as quads, and convex polygons after clipping; triangles are formed as the final step before rendering. Of course 3D models can contain triangles - like in the original DF.

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Last edited by lucius on Feb 14, 2009 20:39; edited 1 time in total

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 20:36    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Cool, thanks for the explanation. I may have overlooked it before because either I didn't notice it because my other computer is much faster, or because I just didn't understand it to begin with. Most likely the latter Razz

But now I understand. Thanks lucius!



.... another for the FAQ? Laughing

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

lucius
DarkXL Developer
DarkXL Developer

Joined: 17 Feb 2008
PostPosted: Feb 14, 2009 20:52    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Well it didn't slow down on either of my systems that I regularly develop on, so it's easy to miss if you're system is relatively fast. Smile

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DarkXL....http://darkxl.wordpress.com

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003
PostPosted: Mar 20, 2009 08:16    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote
Okay... I need to NOT buy any more computers Laughing but I think I've found my match Smile

Anyway, Dark XL runs without fail or flaw under my new laptop. Oddly enough, even DOSBox DF runs better on this computer than my desktop iMac (bonus!!!) and that computer is more powerful than this one.

My Specs! Very Happy

Asus N80 Series
Windows Vista x64 Home Premium (Not thrilled about it, but it's not as bad as I thought it would be)
Intel Centrino Dual Core 2.0ghz
4gb RAM (hellz yeah)
Nvidia 9300 GS graphics card
Realtek Audio Hi Def.

Good times shall be had by all!!!

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

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