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DF96: The Ties That Bind (* * * *)

 
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Matt H
Dark Trooper Phase 1

Joined: 24 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 19, 2004 15:49    Post subject: DF96: The Ties That Bind (* * * *) View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote

DF96: The Ties That Bind by Jason Burton, Rick Schmidt, Rich Snodgrass and Jason Terhune (* * * *)

Crow's Nest: 98%

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Barry Brien wrote:
6 level sequel to DF by Jason Burton, Rick Schmidt, Rich Snodgrass and Jason Terhune. Not quite Hall of Fame material, but fun to play nontheless


Geoffrey Simpson wrote:
Not the greatest, but it does have some excellent material. It's just severly lacking in the punch-to-the-jaw department; not enough impressive INF, I'm afraid

------------------
Incredible! One of the worst performances of my career and they never doubted it for a second. -Ferris Bueller


DarthDoctor wrote:
Centainly interesting, though. Lots of original ideas, maybe not just to such great use.

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"Goin' out west where the alligators fight;
They duel all day and they duel all nite;
Afterwards it's all all right;
Out where the alligators fight."

Charles Rigby


Sheldon wrote:
Oh DF96 was a whole lot of fun. But I could never play the Jabba map - it crashes during loading. I do think that 98% rating is too high though - should be around 88.


dfmaverick wrote:
DF96....That was the greatest!

O.k., I'm a bit biased. It's been a long time since I worked on that level. This is Rich Snodgrass throwing my two cents in. It's been ages since I thought about Dark Forces at all, then AOTC comes out and I got all mushy on the good old days. I started searching out what websites were still around devoted to DF. I came across this place, which looks to be the main source, glad to see that DF still has a little niche.

I noticed that my old pal CarGo95 was still around and that people are bashing some of the old levels. I don't mind much, it's just that for the time, DF96 was a bit revolutionary. It was the first to incorporate multilevels, one of the first with the new waxes, thanks to CarGo95.

I haven't played any of the new levels or taken a look at what you can do with editing nowadays, so I'm sure that DF96 has lost its luster from its hayday and am sure it is worthy of downgrading its review rating from the 98% from Crow's Nest.

I'm not gonna make a pitch for it to ever be Hall of Fame, but just wanted to point out that at the time we had limitations with what could be done. WDFUSE was barely out as we were finishing, so most of what we did (90% or so) was on DFUSE(dos) or actual text editing.

Give it a chance guys. Maybe I'll get the energy to come out of retirement and update it to a DFy2k2.

Great to be back,

Rich Snodgrass


JJ wrote:
I always thought that like most of the levels in the hall of fame, DF-96 raised the bar for all levels that followed and as a result may well be worthy of the hall. It was certainly a ground breaker and one of the projects that inspired me to get into editing. I don't see a problem celebrating levels that by todays standards may not be what they once were. Without these ground breaking levels it is difficult to imagine celebrating levels such as those now in the hall. We owe much of the success of newer levels to the early efforts that came before. This was one of those great efforts.


DarthDoctor wrote:
What Kurek did for atmosphere, DF96 did for INF. Some of the effects are just great...

And I think it was the first joint effort between a lot of 'good' mappers. The levels have a strong bond, and they have similar tempos and feelings while remaining individual.

Yes, it has it problems (japh, try exiting DF, then just try loading Jabbas, then exit again and then load the next one. Works for me...) I think it was the most realisitci multilevel levels out there. Well, at the time, it didn't have much competetion. But still, some bits of arcitexture recurr from level to level, much of the mood is similar, they are great.

I ddin't like the WD level, but that's just personal opinion...

------------------
"Goin' out west where the alligators fight;
They duel all day and they duel all nite;
Afterwards it's all all right;
Out where the alligators fight."

Charles Rigby


.

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 21, 2004 05:45    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote

This series was actually the catalyst for the inspiration for me to create the Jedi Crystal. It is an interesting short series with an interesting story with some good ideas. I like that this is the longest series currently available (With the acception for Don Seilke's DF levels and TJ13's Dark Siege series). While the series did have its interesting points, it appears that it was done in quite a hurry, as some levels were not very well done. I liked it for the most part except for the level on Faust where I had lost every life I had painstakingly saved within the first few areas. But the story and the other better levels make up for it.

This level series was okay, but some things about it just crippled it a bit. But it did present some interesting ideas as well as an interesting story. Worthy of its rank. 6.7 of 10.

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

Darth Oosha
Trandoshan

Joined: 24 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 22, 2004 02:04    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote

Burning Gundam wrote:
I like that this is the longest series currently available (With the acception for Don Seilke's DF levels and TJ13's Dark Siege series).



Prophecy was 7 1/2 levels, which were really quite crappy overall.

You might also want to make an exception for Beyond Dark Forces, which someone made to patch together 13 of other peoples' levels into some kind of overall plot.

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 22, 2004 03:04    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote

Those must have been before my time. I know nothing about them.

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

JJ
Ree-Yees

Joined: 28 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 23, 2004 18:07    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote

This level was one of the best of its time. It came out before many of the effects used today were refined. I think for its time this level was very well done and deserves mention as a possible Hall of Fame candidate. Not all of the levels were equally as fun but overall it was an enjoyable experience. I think we forget that many of the techniques used in newer levels came into being later in the editing community. Unfortunately I think it is too easy for new levels to gain praise and too difficult for the pioneers to gain recognition for their accomplishments. This is not the sort of level we should be comparing to todays levels. It should be seen in light of its time.

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 23, 2004 18:10    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote

True. Painfully true. Especially with the Dark Tide III and IV levels lurking over the horizon. By that time, nothing will be able to bring it under another level.

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

Nottheking
Kell Dragon

Joined: 29 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Apr 23, 2004 22:31    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote

I imagine that this must have been amazing for the first generation of DF work. INF effects, creative arcitecture to simulate new environments, and new enemies must have been quite impressive. Unforunately, it was looked over for quite some time, and just doesn't stand up to the levels availible today, but the pack is quite possibly the best of all pre-Kurek levels. Although a bit bland looking in many parts, there are many highlights, and it has what might be the best beginning of any level! (please don't blow up the band!)
  • Quality: 80%
  • Atmosphere: 60%
  • Gameplay: 85%
  • Innovation: 95%
  • Overall: 80%


_________________
Wake up, George Lucas... The Matrix has you..

TheIntellectual
Ree-Yees

Joined: 20 Jun 2004

PostPosted: Mar 07, 2005 07:34    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote

See my other post in the general discussion section about the need for the walkthrough... thanks!

Barry Brien
Dark Trooper Phase 1

Joined: 26 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Jun 17, 2005 03:56    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote

I remember really looking forward to its release, checking the website every day and being amazed by the screenshots.

Its still fun to play, but I guess it does seem a bit dated. My biggest problem with it is that a lot of the architecture is dull, and certain levels can be repetitious.

I think the corvette level is cool, and the Tatooine level features some cool stuff.

The final level could have been better.

Burning Gundam
Kell Dragon

Joined: 28 Sep 2003

PostPosted: Jun 17, 2005 06:22    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Reply with quote

I have yet to finish this series because of the final level Sad . And I don't like to cheat until I've played it through at least once.

_________________
I don't think outside the box... I customize it.

Jake
Dianoga

Joined: 14 Jul 2004

PostPosted: Feb 24, 2010 11:11    Post subject: View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote

Burning Gundam wrote:
I have yet to finish this series because of the final level Sad . And I don't like to cheat until I've played it through at least once.



I just finished it tonight for the first time. That final level is rough. You know a level's going to be a doozy when the first thing you have to do is use a remote mine to hurl yourself across a huge, bottomless gap. Shocked

BTW, I had to use the teleport cheat to beat the level. To get to the final half of the map, you somehow have to get the main staircase to go back down. The switch that I believe raised it in the first place wouldn't switch back, so... yeah. You got me there.

Overall, I liked DF96. It's rare to get a good, cohesive level pack that tells a complete story. The missions are varied - you start in a bar on Ord Mantell, travel to Hoth and Tatooine, and end up at the very foot of the Emperor's throne. However, there is a certain lack of oomph to it that's hard to explain - the levels just don't give you the kind of payoff that you expect in, say, a HoF entry - case in point would be the very end. You rescue your son and defeat the Emperor, but then just escape in a shuttle - and that's kinda it. Of course, this was early on in DF editing and deserves a bit of slack on the technical side. I find the difficulty to skew hard, between the frustrating puzzles and the sometimes excessive amount of enemies. Ultimately, I think it deserves every one of its four stars, but it doesn't have that special extra something to give it five.

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